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What do i do if my posts are like Saito?

drslg 28 February 2011

My vibe has post like Saito Vibraphones.

Saito posts are open. they do not bend over, letting the string rise up when i release the dampener. see attachment for pic. All the posts are like that. it was just easier to get a picture of the end post.

Modern posts ( such as those on the m-55)have a peice of medal that bends over the hook holding it in place when the pedal moves.

So whenever i let the pedal up, the bars pop up. because of this, no dampener material can stop the ringing because the bars only move with it. Previously, these posts caused the bars to buzz. To stop this, I changed the felt. No longer does the felt buzz, but it doesn't stop the note right away. Instead the notes hang and slowly fade, which almost destroys the purpose of having a pedal.
I have tried pulling the string down, but that cannot be done on the "white keys" because there is no space. I have also tried bending the posts back. that doesn't work either. What can i do? replace the posts? Please help

Comments

tonymiceli Tue, 03/01/2011 - 12:40

looks like you're programming in assembly language!

post or link to photos (if you're not a subscriber).

i sent that to nico and he didn't have a clue what you were talking about.

tedwolff Tue, 03/01/2011 - 13:39

That's more like machine language, talking directly to the computer with no compiler/interpreter what so ever. The language of the ancients.

tpvibes Tue, 03/01/2011 - 14:16

One of my first programming experiences was on an HP minicomputer where you had to enter the programs in binary one word at a time using 16 switches on the front panel. There's a current commercial where they talk about, "the ancient one, he who speaks of floppy disks" -- what a youngster :-).

Tom P.

tonymiceli Wed, 03/02/2011 - 01:30

all the old heads are thinking about early programming.

assembly language was also 0's and 1's right? i programmed in it as i remember. i mean as an amateur but i was messing around with it.

hey, i also learned pascal and wrote a check book program. i did hypercard and did an eartraining program that worked via midi and was in the share ware magazines!!!! remember how we bought software? the magazine with the list of freeware and shareware. we'd ORDER SOFTWARE through the mail. jeeeeeeeez.

IndianaGlen Tue, 03/08/2011 - 09:54

When I started, it was so long ago we didn't even have 1's. Only Zeros...

OK about the vibe, was that a design flaw, or did/does that vibe actually have all "U" posts?
If it was originally that way, the damper 'should' have worked from the factory right? I do agree with the hooked posts that the musser vibes used would work better for dampening, and if it were me, I'd replace them probably.

drslg Tue, 03/08/2011 - 19:28

the dampener worked right out of the factory. I know the u posts have always been. The question is if they have always worked properly

vibeman27 Tue, 03/01/2011 - 19:23

what you are trying to tell us. The posts on the inside rails are u shaped instead of the normal open hook posts. As a result nothing is restraining the strings from rising up when you press the damper pedal. It also sounds like your damper pedal has to much "rise" in it. I tried to find your previous pictures of your set but can't find it, too much hunting. If you try, I am sure you can take a better picture of the posts, even the ones in the middle, so that everyone can see what you actually trying to describe.

As it stands from the information you have presented, the only thing you can do (I think) is to replace all the posts on the inside rails of your vibes. It is a touchy operation and a pro should probably do it. But you can do it if you are mechanically inclined. You have to measure the exact height of the curve in the u posts. Extract all those, and individually and carefully hammer in your new posts to the point where the curve in the c part of the new posts are at that same height. The one thing I really can't tell you is where to get the c posts for that set of vibes. Maybe a pro is the only option for you.

If what I said doesn't make sense or you can't do it, then try and post as many pictures as you can so maybe someone will better understand your problem with the posts, strings and damper.

You might also want to post on the TheVibe.net in the appropriate forum for repair and seek answers there.

Good luck to you.

BruceW

drslg Tue, 03/01/2011 - 19:50

i will probably call a near by percussion repairman soon. He will take a look at it. In your reply, you said that you think my dampener gives to much rise. I actually can adjust that with little nuts on the way left and right of the dampener bar. When i tighten the nuts, the dampener will rise until it hits the nut, which will stop it short. if i bring the nuts up, the bar will not stop until that point, completely lifting the bars from there posts. I have tried moving the nuts up and down, but that is not making a difference. But if i mange to get "C" posts, the nuts will help dramatically.

Vince H Thu, 03/10/2011 - 18:44

I know the problem you are describing. I have seen the Saito design problem and also had a similar problem with my second vibe, a Musser Century from the middle of the last century.

A very simple solution, if you don't take the bars off, is to glue the cord into the post with a blob of glue from a hot melt glue gun.

Another solution would be to use short lengths of thin rubber tubing--say 3/4 long. Cut a slit in the tube to about 1/4 inch from the top. Slide the tube over the string and the post.

A third solution would be to use nylon cord--not stretch, such as woven fishing line--and essentially tie the bar cord into the frame.

A fourth solution would be to bend short lengths of stiff wire into "L" shapes. Slide the stem of the L (base of the L is up--that is, the L is upside down) into the rubber insulating sleeve. You may need to put one on each sie of the Saito U support.

Fifth solution: You could also use a "U" shaped wire, again, upside down, and push it down over the cord into the bar support sleeve, anchoring the cord in place.

None of these solutions are very elegant for the long haul. All but 4 make it difficult to remove the bars for transport. However, if you never take the vibe apart (you don't move it or you only move it assembled in a van or truck), thse are options. Personally, I'd start with 5 and work back, but I don't have your vibe in front of me.

But, as Bruce stated, the best approach is to replace the "u" shaped hood with claw-shaped ones. Check with Saito to see if they make some; they may for their newer instruments. Musser will probably work, but you should order a few and test it first. You may damage the wood of the rail as you extrac the Saito hooks. To fix that, you'll need to drill the hole out and glue a dowel in, then redrill and put in the new hook. But hopefully this won't happen. An issue on replacement will be checking to see that the Saito U height is the same height as the bottom of the Musser claw hook. You will need to buy a caliper to get it all right. The heights of all the hooks need to be the same or you will get ringing from those that are elevated.

With any experiment/change, you should test first by doing just a few. Take you time and ask for help. Almost everything you do can be reversed if you go about it slowly and thoughtfully.

Piper Mon, 03/14/2011 - 06:57

The best solution is to replace the posts. For a quick fix now, take a piece of string and weave it over the string and under the rail and tie it down. This is easy and will hold the bars down firm.

You could experiment with this concept using rubber bands, small bungies, or anything that would hold the string/bars down. Pretty easy fixings.....be creative and don't be afraid to repair your instrument.

Vince H Sat, 03/26/2011 - 12:26

John, myself, and many others have tried many things to improve our vibes. The thing you learn when doing this is that there are the ideas you have, and the execution of those ideas, and the execution given the materials and skills you have to work with and there's a big gap among those. Zipties didn't work--that doesn't mean the idea was wrong. Try again--use string or any one of the solutions I suggested. You have to experiment, and when the experiment fails, you have to analyze the reasons for failure and then try again, correcting the problem. Do it in small pieces and try it on only a few bars at a time.

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